[Cricket] It's just not cricket

crodonilson · May 7, 2024

Joe Root leads PCA calls for schedule change in domestic cricket

Joe Root is leading calls from players to reduce the amount of domestic cricket and review a schedule that is “not fit for purpose”.

www.bbc.com

Joe Root and other players complaining too many domestic games in the calendar, and with the advent of the Hundred (which isn't going anywhere) I think it's fair to say thew calendar is just a mess. So if you were the head of the ECB what would your solutions be??

Personally I think we have an issue in there are too many games, and more so there are too many games that have little riding on them. So we need to reduce the volume of games but makes as many of those games played mattering.

I would regionalise the County Championship, as they did in the covid season, either 3 groups of 6 or two groups of 9. Using the two groups of 9 each team would play 8 games, 4 at home and 4 away. Then the top 2 from each region would play semi finals (1v2 and 2v1) for the Championship with the winners meeting in the final, then the next 2 would play off the a 'shield' (3v4, 4v3) and so on. This would reduce the number of matches from 14 to 10, freeing up some 16 days in the schedule and with all games ending in a form of knockout format to decide overall placings among the 18 should ensure every game is competitive and has something riding on it (and even lower down the placings the games would be against similar quality teams),

I would then look to make the One Day Cup a genuine knockout cup from the beginning, obviously with 18 counties that would make it difficult but if you invited the likes of Scotland, Ireland, even the Netherlands to take part and then the 3 best minor counties would give 24 teams. If the top 8 received Round 1 byes you would have counties 9-18 plus aforementioned invited teams in one off winner takes all preliminary round to go through to the First Round Proper (and potentially to even up the games make them played at lower seeded sides home). Then the winners go through to Round of 16 with top 8 teams, completely open FA Cup style draw. I'd trial making these games two legged, and if there is no clear winner over the two games decide them on net run rate (or a super over). The winners would go through to the QF's and semi's and these would all be two legged before a final at Lords. The losers of the first round proper would then go into a knockout plate QF and so on. Currently there are 77 fixtures in the One Day Cup which is played during the Hundred by essentially 2nd 11/youth sides. The current One Day Cup format has 77 fixtures in total, the above if you including a plate format for knocked out sides in Round One would be 50 games in total and every fixture would have something riding on it, given the reduction in fixtures alongside the county reduction it should mean space in the calendar for it to be a proper senior competition.

essbee1 · May 7, 2024

I used to enjoy the T20 stuff. But now players bugger off on international duty, for
promotional events in the USA etc while the T20 is going on (no work around) which
makes it pointless going to watch. It's like the Albion playing PL matches while
3 or 4 of our best players are playing for their countries. Crazy really.

I follow Surrey - so maybe Sussex fans won't appreciate this problem

Nobby Cybergoat · May 7, 2024

Well.

I'd bin off the hundred and expand the CC. But I guess this is a bit fantasy land.

One day cup doesn't need all those group games, agree. Straight knockout sounds fun. I'd have the bottom sides from this years groups playing off for a place in next years competition

fly high · May 7, 2024

crodonilson said:
Joe Root leads PCA calls for schedule change in domestic cricket

Joe Root is leading calls from players to reduce the amount of domestic cricket and review a schedule that is “not fit for purpose”.

www.bbc.com

Joe Root and other players complaining too many domestic games in the calendar, and with the advent of the Hundred (which isn't going anywhere) I think it's fair to say thew calendar is just a mess. So if you were the head of the ECB what would your solutions be??

Personally I think we have an issue in there are too many games, and more so there are too many games that have little riding on them. So we need to reduce the volume of games but makes as many of those games played mattering.

I would regionalise the County Championship, as they did in the covid season, either 3 groups of 6 or two groups of 9. Using the two groups of 9 each team would play 8 games, 4 at home and 4 away. Then the top 2 from each region would play semi finals (1v2 and 2v1) for the Championship with the winners meeting in the final, then the next 2 would play off the a 'shield' (3v4, 4v3) and so on. This would reduce the number of matches from 14 to 10, freeing up some 16 days in the schedule and with all games ending in a form of knockout format to decide overall placings among the 18 should ensure every game is competitive and has something riding on it (and even lower down the placings the games would be against similar quality teams),

I would then look to make the One Day Cup a genuine knockout cup from the beginning, obviously with 18 counties that would make it difficult but if you invited the likes of Scotland, Ireland, even the Netherlands to take part and then the 3 best minor counties would give 24 teams. If the top 8 received Round 1 byes you would have counties 9-18 plus aforementioned invited teams in one off winner takes all preliminary round to go through to the First Round Proper (and potentially to even up the games make them played at lower seeded sides home). Then the winners go through to Round of 16 with top 8 teams, completely open FA Cup style draw. I'd trial making these games two legged, and if there is no clear winner over the two games decide them on net run rate (or a super over). The winners would go through to the QF's and semi's and these would all be two legged before a final at Lords. The losers of the first round proper would then go into a knockout plate QF and so on. Currently there are 77 fixtures in the One Day Cup which is played during the Hundred by essentially 2nd 11/youth sides. The current One Day Cup format has 77 fixtures in total, the above if you including a plate format for knocked out sides in Round One would be 50 games in total and every fixture would have something riding on it, given the reduction in fixtures alongside the county reduction it should mean space in the calendar for it to be a proper senior competition.

Isn't the number of international matches also a major issue. This summer England have 18 matches, 6 of which are 5 day tests & every winter they now seem to have 2 overseas tours. Used to be you'd see your international players playing for their counties, now it's the occasional match just for a bit of practice or match fitness.

hans kraay fan club · May 7, 2024

Scrap the loss-making fancy-dress nonsense of the hundred.

Enforce a limit on overseas players of TWO per county, for the whole summer - no short-term deals allowed - with only all-format contracts permitted.

The constant churn of mercenaries prevents fans having any affinity / connection with their county side. Having someone 'sign' for three CC matches as an extended batting net, or signing only for the T20 competition, etc is bullshit.

Change at Barnham · May 7, 2024

You're sounding and wishing the same as most county cricket fans think.
Unfortunately the one point you have made that is massively wrong is that "The Hundred isn't going anywhere".

I hate The Hundred and most cricket fans I know also hate it.
However, the money men have found interested parties, mostly probably Indian, who will pay millions for each franchise.
This will happen as the counties can't refuse the money on offer.

The Hundred will then have ten franchises based at test match grounds which will eventually change back to T20 franchise competition.
The ECB will then have a ten franchise competition that would have have replaced the existing 18 county T20 Blast via the back door.
Sussex, Northants, Leicester, Derby, Kent, Worcester and a couple of other counties will then be returned to what is essentially a minor county competition.

The writing has been on the wall for several seasons which is extremely depressing if you are a fan of Sussex.

And more importantly The Hundred is going nowhere.

amexer · May 7, 2024

interesting Root makes no mention of Hundred competion and 20/20 have taken over to the detriment of 4 day game.
Get rid of hundred. Play 20/20 Friday evening or Sunday throughout season and bring back 50 over to a first team knock out competition. I can rememember waiting in car before going to meeting to hear who Sussex had drawn in next round. Stop farce of when our season starts players not available because playing abroad. If they want that choice dont select them here

Eeyore · May 7, 2024

@crodonilson

Well done for making a sensible post on the matter.

I would say the One Day cup could move to the old B & H group format with four groups of five. QF etc. That's 7 games for the winner, but it could be played over the summer. Your Championship suggestion seems reasonable.

The Hundred isn't going anywhere. Especially if the Indian money comes in. Don't rule out the Yanks either. The 20 overs World Cup has them involved this time round. And has most of them don't have any respect for sporting integrity (see football) we're basically buggered.

crodonilson · May 7, 2024

amexer said:
0 Friday evening or Sunday throug

Eeyore said:
@crodonilson

Well done for making a sensible post on the matter.

I would say the One Day cup could move to the old B & H group format with four groups of five. QF etc. That's 7 games for the winner, but it could be played over the summer. Your Championship suggestion seems reasonable.

The Hundred isn't going anywhere. Especially if the Indian money comes in. Don't rule out the Yanks either. The 20 overs World Cup has them involved this time round. And has most of them don't have any respect for sporting integrity (see football) we're basically buggered.

I think a cup style format right through from the beginning would offer a point of difference against the overall league format of the Championship and the group/knockout format of the T20 blast but take on board your point that at least with a group start every team gets at least 4 games whereas in mine they could have as few as one or two, but that's the jeopardy of the open FA Cup style format. I agree though I think the One Day Cup should be given some breathing space and played over the entirely of the summer, first round(s) in Apr/May through to an early September final as opposed to the 'window' the Blast is played in through June/early July.

Sadly the Hundred is only going to become a bigger beast and more far removed from the traditional counties so I think you have to view the more traditional summer as one played Apr-Jul and then in September as I don't see much value or integrity in playing any of the other formats with severely depleted sides through August.

A1X · May 7, 2024

Unlike many on here, I do actually enjoy the Hundred as a spectacle, and I also feel there is a scenario where all four competitions can be made to work together. Much of the problem is whether there is the will to do it, and I think Sky (desperate as they are to make sure The Hundred and the Blast don't interfere with their precious football coverage as much as possible) are the major blocker to this.

Pevenseagull · May 7, 2024

Bin the hundred.

Start the T20 on Friday July 19th. A home and away t20 daytime weekends, a home and away fixture weekday evenings starting at 6.30. Tighter penalties for over rate. Group stages wrapped up by Sunday August 11th. Quarter finals mid week. Finals day first weekend of September.. At least one full CC home fixture during August.

International cricket (tests) to be played alongside the T20. The teams based at the test ground can hold their t20s at out grounds when hosting internationals.

Lot more opportunities for kids around the country to get to a game during the school holidays. Which I am pretty sure is one of the key responsibilities of the ECB.

stewart12 · May 7, 2024

so many of these issues could have been prevented by not introducing a 4th competition in what was already a jam packed season

I agree with previous posters that the OD competition could be a knock out, giving more time to the County Championship, which is the competition that provides England with test team players and should be a priority, and the t20 competition which is a good money maker for counties IF treated as important by the ECB. If the t20 blast had EVER been given the level of exposure (live games on BBC!) and marketing that the hundred had it would be a success

hans kraay fan club · May 7, 2024

hans kraay fan club said:
Enforce a limit on overseas players of TWO per county, for the whole summer - no short-term deals allowed - with only all-format contracts permitted.

The constant churn of mercenaries prevents fans having any affinity / connection with their county side. Having someone 'sign' for three CC matches as an extended batting net, or signing only for the T20 competition, etc is bullshit.

To illustrate this, these are 'our' overseas players for the County Championship alone, this season:

Cheteshwar Pujara (India, seven matches, April – May)
Jayden Seales (West Indies, April – June 8)
Daniel Hughes (Australia, June – September)
Nathan McAndrew (Australia, June – July)
Jaydev Unadkat (India, five matches, August – September)

timbha · May 7, 2024

ECB needs to decide and communicate what it is trying to achieve:
Winning the Ashes?
More kids and people playing cricket?
Greater Sky, etc coverage?
More money for the elite clubs?
The growth of cricket in every county in the UK?
A white ball World Cup win?
Or to line its own pockets!!?
Or whatever…..

I love cricket but have no idea where it’s going or where it wants to go.

Oh, and bin the Hundred

Nobby Cybergoat · May 7, 2024

hans kraay fan club said:
To illustrate this, these are 'our' overseas players for the County Championship alone, this season:

Cheteshwar Pujara (India, seven matches, April – May)
Jayden Seales (West Indies, April – June 8)
Daniel Hughes (Australia, June – September)
Nathan McAndrew (Australia, June – July)
Jaydev Unadkat (India, five matches, August – September)

With only one out of those being a top class player .

It could be banned, but Sussex have questions to answer about why we're blocking the development of our own players with overseas also rans

Change at Barnham · May 7, 2024

Pevenseagull said:
Bin the hundred.

Start the T20 on Friday July 19th. A home and away t20 daytime weekends, a home and away fixture weekday evenings starting at 6.30. Tighter penalties for over rate. Group stages wrapped up by Sunday August 11th. Quarter finals mid week. Finals day first weekend of September.. At least one full CC home fixture during August.

International cricket (tests) to be played alongside the T20. The teams based at the test ground can hold their t20s at out grounds when hosting internationals.

Lot more opportunities for kids around the country to get to a game during the school holidays. Which I am pretty sure is one of the key responsibilities of the ECB.

A lovely thought, but unfortunately The Hundred is here to stay due to it's financial value as it has been created to be sold off to franchises.

Once we accept that The Hundred is here to stay in some form we then have to work out how to incorporate it into the schedule, whilst not clashing with the football season in August. The way this is done unfortunately is eventually binning off the T20 Blast as a major competition and making it a secondary level, minor competition.

Basically the smaller counties are getting shafted. It doesn't matter what ideas we come up with as an alternative schedule.
It will be decided at the corporate level with multi-million bids coming in for each franchise.
The likes of Colin Graves and Rod Bransgrove will be sailing off into the sunset with IPL owners running the show in England.

The IPL now runs the South African T20 competition, The Caribbean competition and the UAE competition.
They are in discussions with Saudi Arabia for a new competition there. There is also a new T20 competition beginning in USA.
The biggest game in this years T20 World Cup between India and Pakistan is being played in New York City.

The shit future we worried about is already here.

All the previous ideas on this thread are very laudable and well meaning but basically we are being swallowed up by a monster that is offering debt-ridden counties too much money to refuse.
We are about to sell our Crown Jewels (if we haven't already).

Any suggestions on how to re-shape future English summers is just like rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.

We are still in a battle, but India has already won the war.

hans kraay fan club · May 7, 2024

Nobby Cybergoat said:
With only one out of those being a top class player .

It could be banned, but Sussex have questions to answer about why we're blocking the development of our own players with overseas also rans

They are all decent players, and I have no problem with any of them individually.

Only two at any time can play, so I don't see them as a block to our own talent either - the county has done a really good job of developing young players recently, tbf - possibly over-using them if anything, at some points.

My issue really is the short-term nature of these deals.

I have fantastic memories as a kid of a Sussex side, with Imran and Garth LeRoux as THE overseas players. Those guys and Mushy I think of as true 'Sussex players'. Nobody in a decade or more, is going to remember Unadkat, or gaze back fondly at the time Steve Smith used us for a month to get his eye in.

ROSM · May 7, 2024

hans kraay fan club said:
They are all decent players, and I have no problem with any of them individually.

Only two at any time can play, so I don't see them as a block to our own talent either - the county has done a really good job of developing young players recently, tbf - possibly over-using them if anything, at some points.

My issue really is the short-term nature of these deals.

I have fantastic memories as a kid of a Sussex side, with Imran and Garth LeRoux as THE overseas players. Those guys and Mushy I think of as true 'Sussex players'. Nobody in a decade or more, is going to remember Unadkat, or gaze back fondly at the time Steve Smith used us for a month to get his eye in.

And of course Michael Bevan. Who arrived at sussex as the self proclaimed 'best one day player in the world'. Trouble was, based on his sussex performances, nobody could work out which 'one day' that was.

um bongo molongo · May 7, 2024

This won’t be a popular opinion, but here it is anyway.

There’s just too many teams with 18 counties. There are only 6 Sheffield Shield teams in Oz. This means not only too much cricket but also the talent is too diffused, making the overall standard not demanding enough. Two (or 3) divisions doesn’t deal with that (our best ever Test batsman is currently playing in Div 2). I think they missed a trick not creating Regional instead of city based Franchise teams, and having them play across formats. South (Sussex/Hampshire), South East (Kent/Essex), South West, East Midlands, West Midlands, North West, North East, Wales and London would give 9 sides. 4 days games would move around the regions. A two week 50 over tournament could be held around the May half term/second bank holiday, adding Scotland, Ireland and Netherlands in 2 groups of 6, with 5 ‘game weeks’ played concurrently over 10 days, followed by semis and a final. Again, using a mixture of grounds across the region. Then a single T20 or Hundred tournament (they’re basically the same format) in the school summer holidays. The existing counties would then be organised in the tiers below this Regional system, in a pyramid system (with minor counties able to get promoted up the tiers and vice versa).

It would provide less, and better, cricket. But its too radical for most and people will hate the idea of killing off the County Championship.

Gwylan · May 7, 2024

um bongo molongo said:
This won’t be a popular opinion, but here it is anyway.

There’s just too many teams with 18 counties. There are only 6 Sheffield Shield teams in Oz. This means not only too much cricket but also the talent is too diffused, making the overall standard not demanding enough.

How can the talent be too diffused in England and not in Australia? We have, as near as dammit, exactly the same number of first-class teams per head of population.

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